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Tuesday, 5 May 2009

FIT and EGT at smashEDO Mayday events

New batch of pics of both FIT and EGT at Brighton now uploaded!

Accessible here
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62 comments:

gene hunt said...

well I never they have all got their collar numbers on and visible ! What are you going to pick up on this time

5 May 2009 at 14:04
jonsparta said...

Booo...where is my picture! i was standing there waving at you for ages. Still better luck next time. I do like the pic's we have of you lot. still we wont keep them, nothing of evidential value...so i have been told.

6 May 2009 at 05:25
Anonymous said...

More pics

http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2009/05/429409.html?c=on#c222684

6 May 2009 at 06:46
jaxwabbit said...

Hello. We have FIT working in Edinburgh .. .some of them are quite nice and deserve to have their pictures added !

6 May 2009 at 09:01
Really Fit said...

Jaxwabbit, please feel free to send some pics of the nice Edinburgh FIT

6 May 2009 at 13:14
Anonymous said...

Here's an example of true bravery from police

http://tiny.cc/u3TAa

oops!

6 May 2009 at 13:54
Anonymous said...

Sorry do brave police here better

visit tiny.cc/u3TAa

6 May 2009 at 14:11
griselda said...

May I just say that I am very pleased to see this blog, I wish more people would realise just how bad this country suffers at the hands of the police. Thugs in blue, they will never change.

6 May 2009 at 23:26
Anonymous said...

Good video, anon @ 13.54
That's the way to deal with police violence.

7 May 2009 at 00:33
Metcountymounty said...

They weren't police, they were security for the football stadium.

7 May 2009 at 09:48
Anonymous said...

They were behaving like police, and as I said, that's the way to deal with police violence. Anyway, MCM, don't object, I'm sure everyone involved was trained to behave that way.

7 May 2009 at 14:10
Anonymous said...

Knowing how the Portuguese Police work, if one of them was being kicked in the head repeatedly until unconscious while on the floor, more than a couple of people would have been shot. If the guy on the floor was resisting then some strikes would have been perfectly justified, but you'll never know because you can't see. Justified action? maybe, maybe not, but hey, put us all in the same group because we wear a uniform.

By the same token you're all a bunch of peace destroying anarchists hell bent on burning cities to the ground then. Thought so.

7 May 2009 at 14:21
McGonagall said...

I'm a pacifist.

7 May 2009 at 20:07
Anonymous said...

"By the same token you're all a bunch of peace destroying anarchists hell bent on burning cities to the ground then. Thought so."

sorry what guff you really don't know the meaning of that. If you want that then mobilised football fans against something would be closer to the truth.

meanwhile nectu boss quite complementary about environmental protesters.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00k4g57/The_Report_07_05_2009/

but that barrister misusing the harassment act, twat

anon

7 May 2009 at 23:03
Anonymous said...

scunnert, it doesn't matter whether you say you're a pacifist or not. Some demonstrators and their supporters call for active violence in the name of militant protest therefor all of you are violent anarchists who want to terrify everyone in the name of your various causes.

To use the logic displayed by some here against all Police officers or even those "who act like Police" so you'll all get what you deserve, whether you think you should or not.

Not nice being so loosely stereotyped as a violent thug because of someone else's actions is it?

8 May 2009 at 01:23
Clovis said...

"scunnert, it doesn't matter whether you say you're a pacifist or not. Some demonstrators and their supporters call for active violence in the name of militant protest therefor all of you are violent anarchists who want to terrify everyone in the name of your various causes."

The logic of a lunatic.

8 May 2009 at 01:42
Really Fit said...

The point that seems to be being made here, is that it is unfair to criticise all police because of the violent behaviour of some of them.

The problem with this argument is, that (unlike anarchists) police are indeed trained to behave that way. And lets face it, it would be pretty ridiculous to have a police force that could only ask the baddies nicely to come down the station...

The police are violent because society accepts that they are violent. The problem is the hypocrisy that says anyone who stands up to them, or defies their 'insructions', has to do so 'non-violently'.

It is just as ridiculous for an anarchists to 'ask nicely' for a police officer just to stand aside for a minute so that they can take a demonstration to EDO, a company that is complicit in extreme violence and illegal acts.

Anarchists need to use 'reasonable force' too. But unlike the police, who never get prosecuted, we get hunted down on violent disorder charges.

8 May 2009 at 03:00
Metcountymounty said...

The reason the Police are trained to be violent in some situations is because society REQUIRES us to be so, this is the whole point of Policing by consent. Society require the Police to have the responsibility of dealing with violent situations on the populations behalf - and that means EVERYONE and not just the people living in the immediate area or those involved in whatever incident it is. Personally I think the situation has gone too far and the population are afraid (rightly) of dealing with anything themselves through fear of prosecution, or a lack of Police resources until the situation escalates to something more dangerous, which is completely unacceptable.

In nearly all the situations we deal with violence never comes into the equation and you'll never hear about them, and there are others when to not use violent tactics would put us and the public - and occasionally the suspect - at greater risk of harm. This includes rioting by organised or at least contributing parties as well as everyday criminal actions by individuals.

8 May 2009 at 03:57
Anonymous said...

clovis, that "logic of a lunatic" is exactly the same logic that you use against the Police.

Muppet.

8 May 2009 at 04:00
Anonymous said...

People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf. George Orwell.

The other oft quoted Orwell text is 1984 which is becoming remarkably accurate thanks to NuLiebour aka the communist party of Britain.

8 May 2009 at 08:31
Clovis said...

anonymous 0400

er...

no it isn't.

even if you substitute police for bits about demonstrators and their supporters, a) it isn't anywhere near what i'm saying, and b) it makes no sense whatsoever - hence the 'logic of a lunatic' bit.

even if sections of the police and their supporters call for 'active violence' in the name of 'militant enforcement of the law', that would be nothing new - the police federation, for example, has never been backward about coming forward with support for the introduction of more hardware for frontline officers. that certainly wouldn't be something i'd use as a starting point, or even departure point, for arguing that the sections of the police are paramilitary thugs.

statements from past met commissioners about the paramilitarisation of the police, for instance in the 1980s provide more meat on that subject: for example, sir peter imbert, in september 1987, said that '[a] subject for concern is the move towards paramilitarism. i accept that such a move has occurred'.

this certainly doesn't mean that all cops are 'violent' and want to 'terrify everyone'. however, quite a number of level two public order trained cops and, from observation and reports, a very large proportion of level one public order trained officers are violent and don't worry about frightening people, let alone attacking them. even in this case, these officers constitute a minority of police officers. however there is a certain proportion of the level three trained officers who feel the same way, and a rather larger proportion who have no difficulty with harassing people.

as william shatner said in tj hooker, the world's not black and white, there's a million shades of grey: the world's somewhat more complicated than you make it out. but i very much doubt anyone volunteers for units like the tsg or the fit because they want to serve the public in the same famous way dixon of dock green did.

8 May 2009 at 10:53
Anonymous said...

Dixon of Dock Green wasn't in the TSG or FIT, he was made up, and the character was killed on duty by someone offering more violence than he was able to in defending himself. Nice assumption though, if fundamentally flawed.

8 May 2009 at 11:13
Clovis said...

er...

while dixon of dock green was indeed topped by murderer dirk bogarde in 'the blue lamp' (1950), he recovered to star in a tv series which ran from 1955 to 1976.

8 May 2009 at 11:17
Polly said...

MCM, all this talk of police being trained to use force is beside the point. Of course they're trained to use force, when its use is justified. The problem is that they use it as a matter of routine, when it is completely uncalled for. Perhaps this is because they find in practice they usually get away with it, I don't know.
At the same time as being trained to use force, are they also trained how to assess whether force is required? I would assume so, but that part of the training seems to be ignored in practice.

8 May 2009 at 23:02
McGonagall said...

G20 police 'used undercover men to incite crowds'

MP demands inquiry into Met tactics at demo

Jamie Doward and Mark Townsend
The Observer, Sunday 10 May 2009
Article history

Police and protesters clash in London on 1 April 2009. Photograph: Chris Ison/PA

An MP who was involved in last month's G20 protests in London is to call for an investigation into whether the policeused agents provocateurs to incite the crowds.

Liberal Democrat Tom Brake says he saw what he believed to be two plain-clothes police officers go through a police cordon after presenting their ID cards.

Brake, who along with hundreds of others was corralled behind police lines near Bank tube station in the City of London on the day of the protests, says he was informed by people in the crowd that the men had been seen to throw bottles at the police and had encouraged others to do the same shortly before they passed through the cordon.

9 May 2009 at 19:52
Metcountymounty said...

Oh so it must be Police then!! We let loads of people through our cordon on the 1st when they presented ID - they were PRESS with official NUJ ID cards as per instructions from the home office after agreement with the NUJ.

Yet more comment from another know all who believes everything written that is anti Police, Scunnert. Just because the person was an MP doesn't mean they had a clue what was going on at the time. We get allegations from protestors ALL THE TIME about agent provocateurs starting the trouble and it's complete bollocks, because it couldn't possibly be any of their swampy anarchist associates could it!!!

10 May 2009 at 00:18
McGonagall said...

Metcountymounty said...
Oh so it must be Police then!!

http://tinyurl.com/2bxywh

10 May 2009 at 03:45
Anonymous said...

@metcounty mounty

The ournalists you let through- like the ones on threadneedle street where some smug copper was telling them they cant get through even on show of a press card?

There are often allegations of "agent provocateurs" and there is compelling evidence that they do indeed operate- there is evidence that as soon as they were accused of being agent provocateurs they fled back through police lines. Would these be masked up journo's then?!?

I hope you're proud of your force that allowed a man to die so it could protect the bonuses given to bankers.

Ultimately, you are just a tool used to allow those making money off all of our (and your) backs to stay in power.

Also, based on the actions of the police that day (where before the violence that the police incited broke out, a copper looked at me yelled "come on then" and drew his baton, where I was in the midst of a bunch of journalists, noone acting provocatively), it would be fair comment to say that all the pigs were agent provocateurs, since their actions ultimately cauised everything to kick off.

10 May 2009 at 03:48
Anonymous said...

From the guardian:

"When I was in the middle of the crowd, two people came over to me and said, 'There are people over there who we believe are policemen and who have been encouraging the crowd to throw things at the police,'" Brake said. But when the crowd became suspicious of the men and accused them of being police officers, the pair approached the police line and passed through after showing some form of identification.

Brake has produced a draft report of his experiences for the human rights committee, having received written statements from people in the crowd. These include Tony Amos, a photographer who was standing with protesters in the Royal Exchange between 5pm and 6pm. "He [one of the alleged officers] was egging protesters on. It was very noticeable," Amos said. "Then suddenly a protester seemed to identify him as a policeman and turned on him. He ­legged it towards the police line, flashed some ID and they just let him through, no questions asked."

10 May 2009 at 03:52
Anonymous said...

Thats bull shit. Could you imagine the shit the old bill would be in if that was ever proved. It seems that you lot are looking for some sort of reason to kick off , or justify kickin of. If you go to the protest kitted up then you obviously expect a tear up. Start switching on fisters! APAB

10 May 2009 at 06:09
Metcountymounty said...

Scunnert - THAT'S YOUR PROOF? A single video from a protest in CANADA?!?!?! What has that got to do with the Policing by the Met at the G20 in the UK? You are unbelievable.

Take the foil hat off and get a fucking life.

10 May 2009 at 06:53
Clovis said...

A bit of ancient history. When the Metropolitan Police was established, it was made clear that the new force would work exclusively in uniform, to avoid association with the French police which enjoyed a reputation for using underhand tactics such as undercover officers and agents provocateur.

Within a matter of months, plainclothes officers were at work, making a mockery of the earlier assurances.

As academic Gary T Marx has observed, there are numerous examples from British history of use of the agent provocateur. One need only look at the collusion between the security forces and loyalist paramilitaries in Northern Ireland to see this sort of thing in action.

So, as this is something the police have done in Britain in the past, to the extent of encouraging men to commit murder, can it really be concluded that they would shrink from it in London?

Incidentally, if APAB stands for All Protesters Are Bastards, that makes an awful lot of cops 'bastards' for their stroll in London last year.

10 May 2009 at 07:04
Clovis said...

MCM

I'd point out that an MP has called for an investigation into MPS use of agents provocateur - not scunnert. As I've pointed out, there is a sorry history of the use of that tactic in the UK. You're clearly not familiar with the case of Tim Hepple, whose activities as an agent provocateur against Green Anarchist in the 90s emerged in the famous GANDALF case. So, unless you have proof to the contrary, let's see what happens with any inquiry about this. You may not believe that the police employ such means; but then you're not privy to everything the police do at public order or other situations, are you - you wouldn't expect Captain Mainwaring to tell Private Pike his secret orders!

10 May 2009 at 07:16
Metcountymounty said...

how can you obtain proof of something that doesn't exist? especially when the majority of parties involved (such as anarchists and rioters) would refuse to identify themselves and account for their actions? at least any Police involvement would be documented somewhere but then I'd guess you could STILL say that absence of the documentation would be proof of existence? Nothing would appease or convince mugs like Scunnert because even if you had proof of the actions of every single Police officer in the country, they'd STILL say there must be people 'off the books' who were involved.

As I've been saying from day one, let's wait until the inquiry and the evidence gathering exercise is concluded in the investigation before the foil hat brigade get carried away.

10 May 2009 at 09:29
Clovis said...

I don't think you'd need documentation. Evidence of a certain person being in a certain place at a certain time doing a certain thing would be enough. And there seems to be enough to raise the questions this MP's asking. From appearances, whoever these people were, they seemed to have ID which impressed the police enough to let them through their lines: and remember that at that point the police have said to the MPA that the cordon was impermeable. So this wouldn't seem to be journalists or other non-police people.

Incidentally, the review is of tactics and thus not of all police activity on the day.

10 May 2009 at 09:36
Really Fit said...

I don't know whether this G20 undercover cop story is true, but these tails worry me a little.

Stories of 'agents provocateur' can cause us to turn in on ourselves. It could become all too easy for people to randomly accuse more militant individuals of being plain clothes police. Thus we end up doing the police's job for them...

It could also get to the point where any attacks on corporate property are attributed, not to political motive, but to police trying to 'incite' trouble and get people arrested.

I'm not saying undercover police do not exist. But those I have observed have been getting information, or trying to cause divisions in a crowd and undermine solidarity. There was a strong suspect at a Gaza protest, for example, who was clearly attempting to turn the crowd against a couple of lads who were trying to push open the crowd control barriers.

This sort of thing has to be far more of a problem (for us!)than inciting people to throw bricks or break the windows of RBS.

10 May 2009 at 12:47
McGonagall said...

Western security services have committed terrorist atrocities (such as the bombing of the Balogna railway station where 75 people died} and blamed it on leftist groups.

http://tinyurl.com/p7ke5p

10 May 2009 at 15:42
McGonagall said...

Cops - servants of the people or agents of a repressive state?

10 May 2009 at 15:44
McGonagall said...

Towards A Citizens' Militia: Anarchist Alternatives To NATO & The Warsaw Pact

Anonymous

Edition: pam
ISBN: 9780904564334
Publisher: Cienfuegos
Release Date: 1980-01-01

ITEM OVERVIEW
The legendary anarchist (as opposed to most guerrilla warfare manuals written by military, or authoritarian types) how-to guide to irregular warfare. Towrds A Citizens' Militia details the principles of libertarian armed resistance, organization, and conduct of guerrilla warfare (from train traps to attacking a power system) and the organization and operation of the civilian resistance movement.

10 May 2009 at 15:46
McGonagall said...

Resources:

http://tinyurl.com/r6oqqj

http://tinyurl.com/qpbouc

10 May 2009 at 15:54
Anonymous said...

It seems we need Mulder and Scully on this one.

11 May 2009 at 06:56
Anonymous said...

Scunnert is a Nutter!!!!!!!!!!!!

There's always one frothing at the mouth at the limits of these 'debates'. I despair, I really do.

I give up.

Blithering idiot.....

11 May 2009 at 11:57
McGonagall said...

Anonymous - 11 May 2009 11:57 - said...

"I give up."

We live in hope!

11 May 2009 at 16:37
Anonymous said...

RE Scunert: Bologna bomings,

Those accused of the 7/7 attacks have also been framed. I'd be ashamed to be a police officer knowing his employers have allowed the real culprits of the London bombings to remain at large and in office.

12 May 2009 at 09:39
Anonymous said...

anon 09:39
I imagine that many of the rank and file are quite genuinely convinced by 'the narrative', or tale of 7/7, put forward by the gov. eventually - as a substitute for - and in the absence of - any real actual evidence.
sad but true..

12 May 2009 at 10:54
McGonagall said...

Anons 10:39 & 10:54:

Such evil is no longer unimaginable. Mores the pity.

12 May 2009 at 13:06
Anonymous said...

Sorry, are we saying that the chaps with the bombs strapped to them weren't the guilty ones? fcuk off.

13 May 2009 at 03:12
Anonymous said...

we're saying no evidence - at all. The usual no footage etc. Scamology rules. Bombs in a bathtub - as if! Gullibles believe it. Millions of them.
sad but true.

13 May 2009 at 04:49
Anonymous said...

ANON 0449.......

So, you want more cameras in public places so that there would be proof?

13 May 2009 at 06:53
Clovis said...

Anon 0939 (12/5)

Those accused of the 7/7 bombings are, er, dead.

There's no need to seek for complex solutions when the most obvious and plausible is that the four jihadis accused of bombing the tube and bus that day were found dead at the scene and were therefore responsible.

I'm constantly astounded by people who believe in the need to complicate matters. The truth's enough to confuse - how the government was complicit in a covenant with jihadis, saying they'd be broadly left alone as long as they didn't attack the UK; how people like Hooky Hamza worked with MI5; how the intelligence services managed to lose track of the plotters, or simply hadn't registered them...

But there are sites aplenty where nonsensical conspiraloonery can be discussed among the likeminded. This isn't one of them.

13 May 2009 at 07:18
McGonagall said...

Clovis - 13 May 2009 07:18 - said...

"But there are sites aplenty where nonsensical conspiraloonery can be discussed among the like minded."

http://www.julyseventh.co.uk/

WV = strat - Aye - that's mah axe man.

13 May 2009 at 07:47
Anonymous said...

Clovis is perhaps a little too young to be mindful of the 'complications' which surrounded the Birmingham six, the Guildford four, the Maguire seven and...so on.
More than likely, if it had still been allowed at the time, they would all have been...er deaded.. by hanging.
Never mind, thank you for your revealing insight, a little peek into your mindset.

13 May 2009 at 09:36
Clovis said...

The Birmingham 6, Guildford 4 & Maguire 7 were, of course, not found dead at the scene of bomb attacks, but rather framed by the police. The sort of people who believe that those responsible for bombing the tube and bus on 7/7 were not those found in bits around the scene are, I believe, the same sort of people who come up with increasingly outlandish 'explanations' of Sept 11.

13 May 2009 at 09:54
Anonymous said...

Clovis,

I'm leaving you to it. Good luck with the site.

13 May 2009 at 10:21
McGonagall said...

Wednesday, 13, May 2009 05:56

By politics.co.uk staff

Smith: Don't criticise the police

The home secretary has called for an end to 'police-bashing' after the chorus of condemnation which followed the G20 protests.

Jacqui Smith said Britons should be grateful to have such a good police force.

http://tinyurl.com/pn8bwd

13 May 2009 at 13:12
Anonymous said...

I think the police will want her to fuck off about as much as everyone else.

13 May 2009 at 14:12
Metcountymounty said...

anon 1412 - never a truer word said.

13 May 2009 at 14:46
Anonymous said...

Margaret Beckett on question time last night blamed her false expenses claim on 'being too busy to do everything perfectly' if she thinks that excuse washes can the plod use it too?

15 May 2009 at 16:20
jonsparta said...

I doubt that most MP's have done a days work in years...

18 May 2009 at 03:08
Anonymous said...

Margaret Beckett is too busy looking like a horse's arse.

19 May 2009 at 20:11
Anonymous said...

Wow this is great fun. Just to ake sure i've got the idea.

Take a story form the paper, one where no one here seems to have been there to prove one way or the other, and take it as fact (police agent provocateurs).

Then take a case where there is substantial evidence and claim that it is rubbish (7/7 suspects).

I'll try one. Just read in the daily sport that an alien has made woman's cat pregnant. It's quite obviously true. I think it was Yoda but for sure the police encouraged him to do it.

Sounds ridiculous but in essence all I've done is exaclty what everyone else here seems to do. "I read something, I wasn't there, but it must be true and therefore I've added a whole reality to suit".

You guys must be sooo proud.

22 May 2009 at 14:34
Clovis said...

you seem to be a sip short of a pint. you seem to have ignored my posts above where i said that there was no need to make 7/7 complicated, that the people who died it were found in parts at the scenes of the explosions. if you did read them, i apologise: but recommend you attend remedial reading classes.

23 May 2009 at 05:42

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